I'm now finally getting around to writing up a few impressions from last Thursday the 18th's CJP-sponsored event, "A Community Discussion -- Obama and Netanyahu: Hopes for America and Israel." (See: Why is CJP Giving Oxygen to J-Street? and Jeremy Ben-Ami Thinks HE Was Elected President)

A view across the street before the event: Good guys left, bad guys right.

You'll recall that the original event created an outcry in the community over the fact that CJP was sponsoring an event that gave a place at the mainstream table to the radical left J-Street, and further, gave the other seat to Steve Grossman, who, though a former AIPAC official, is also a Democratic Party activist, thus opening CJP up to having it pointed out that their community discussion took in all viewpoints -- left and far-left. Ken Levin was added as a last minute appeasement in an effort to avoid a pitch-forking.

It now appears we have a name to answer the question of how this happened in the first place, as the evening was put together by young CJP worker-drone and intern for Campus Progress, Celia Segel (Quote of note: "Ayers, who has now shed his role as a member of the radical 1960s group the Weather Underground, is now part of a growing movement of social justice leaders, public school faculty, journalists, politicians, and parents that aim to bring education reform to the forefront of Barack Obama's agenda."), whose daddy, Arthur I. Segel is faculty at Harvard Business School, a CJP co-chair and a big Democrat money-man.

I think we can begin to see how the night started out so skewed left -- acorn/tree and all... Oh, the youth. I've heard rumors that the event and the way it came to be caused quite a controversy within CJP itself. Good.

Controversy or no, the night was a win for Jeremy Ben-Ami and his J-Street. Just getting a seat at the table was all he needed to give his group some sort of credibility. The Israeli far-left has been a dying beast electorally for a number of election cycles. The Israeli public has been mugged by the reality of Oslo and subsequent events which has left their domestic leftist political parties reeling. That's an inconvenience for our own American left, who can keep pushing their own delusions while Israelis cash the checks American Jewish mouths write. Reality hasn't come home to enough American Jews yet, so they can go on playing at being the good Progressive and sending the bill to the Israelis they purport to support.

J-Street's leftist interpretation of events may be completely discredited within the Israeli democratic process, but that doesn't matter here in the US where they can simply buy themselves credibility with a budget, a PR firm, and a few well-placed friends. Money takes the place of a vote on the American scene, as J-Street perversely abuses the American Jewish desire to feel good about themselves to force American officials to pressure Israelis and undermine their democracy.

So it was that Ben-Ami took the stage, smiled, spoke softly, and didn't really bother answering the few pointed remarks directed toward him -- he didn't have to.

The large room was filled, with plenty of the usual anti-Israel Jews and peaceniks from the various "Peace and Justice" groups inside the hall when they would normally be outside protesting (and many of them were outside before the event proceeded). As noted previously, they were specifically mobilized to come and support Ben-Ami -- after all, he represents their best hope of getting their own views into the mainstream. There was even a reporter from the Saudi funded Washington Report on Middle East Affairs trundling about.

Moderator Jonathan Sarna did a good job in keeping the crowd in control, but tried a little too hard to encourage the panelists to focus on agreements over disagreements. That's not how we learn whose views are worthwhile and whose aren't.

Here are some notes on the specifics. Forgive my loose form and shifting tenses:

Steve Grossman started with a fairly boiler-plate run down of the US/Israel relationship. Israel is good for solar energy, technology, energy independence...US and Israel share not just values but also strategic goals.

This was fairly par for the evening. Grossman was fine, but his responses were in the nature of fairly frequently heard political form-letters, about what you would expect from a connected political animal like Grossman...fine, safe, but neither here nor there. No real solutions, just the type of thing that people discuss at summits and board meetings. Status quo, though to his credit he was not averse to voicing a criticism of Obama. Ken Levin's responses provided a bit more meat.

Ben-Ami, asked (or asking, I forget) how we move the Obama/Netanyahu relationship forward agrees with Grossman, but says we may begin to see a growing divergence. There is a fundamental interest in creating a Palestinian State, and that will require very strong US leadership (read: pressure on Israel) as Israelis and Palestinians can't reach agreement on their own (read: they share equal blame).

Ken Levin noted that everyone is interested in peace, the question is how we get there. The Israeli cabinet has endorsed the Roadmap, the PA never has. The question is one of speed -- it will require a fundamental change in Palestinian society under current conditions (Gaza, a weak Abbas...he references the Jackson Diehl report in the Washington Post in which Abbas admits that he can simply sit and do nothing and content himself -- it doesn't bode well).

Moderator question: How should American Jews respond to Obama's pressure on Israel?

Grossman said there will always be disagreements. He thought the Cairo speech put too much responsibility on Israel and not enough on the Arabs. Without pressure on the Arabs the Roadmap will fail. The Arabs want the Palestinians in camps.

(At this point some guy stood up and yelled at the audience to stop applauding when the speakers made points they agreed with. I, of course, applauded a little louder the next couple of times Ken Levin said something I liked.)

Ben-Ami talked about demographics and his worry that the future will end up with a minority ruling over a majority if something isn't done.

Ken Levin noted that it's certainly in Israel's interest to resolve the conflict. If the Roadmap works that's great. Israel's interest is in political separation. Actual peace will come on the Arab timetable, not the Israeli. There are so many Arabs (hundreds of millions) compared to Israelis that that's the way it must be. The Arab autocrats want it that way. Also, look at the conditions of minorities in the Arab world -- Arab supremacism and Islamism/Pan-Arabism (the twin Fascisms). He's a long term optimist toward peace, but a short term pessimist.

Question: What would you advise the leaders to do?

Grossman: Build confidence. Take steps to show you're ready. Settlements are discussed in the Roadmap but they shouldn't dominate the discussion. Within construction borders, natural growth should happen.

Ben-Ami: Strongly disagrees on the issue of settlements. Settlements are killing the future of the State of Israel. At this rate there is no possibility for a Palestinian State. It's the future of Israel on the line. That's the most important thing for the future.

Levin agrees with Grossman. Notes that Ben-Ami is taking a more extreme view than Jimmy Carter (who recently noted that he never imagined Israel would give up ALL of the settlements). Talks about 242 and the fact that no one has ever expected a complete withdrawal. Israel needs defensible borders. Presidents have always recognized this. Most of the natural growth goes on in these areas. Before 1967 the relationship was not strategic because America saw Israel as vulnerable, but after that (after Israel showed it could defend itself), the relationship changed. (I thought this was a great point.)

Ben-Ami agrees that some areas will remain within Israel, so set the borders and build to your heart's content, but set the borders first.

Question: Talk about the two-state solution.

Levin says the US and Israel have agreed to the Roadmap. The trouble is that even at the 1st stage it requires a great deal from the Palestinians. They have to start from scratch, rebuild the middle class that Arafat destroyed, rebuild the Judiciary...it's a long term project. Borders are far in the future on the roadmap.

Grossman notes that when Israel has a partner for peace they show they are willing to go a long way. There doesn't seem to be anyone on the other side right now. Israelis won't accept another Hamastan.

Ben-Ami says no one is talking about the Arab peace initiative -- "there is a partner out there." Talks again about demographics and a need for speed.

Question: Talk about Iran and what we can learn from the past few days. (this is before the crackdown, before Neda, etc...)

Ben-Ami: Glued to the TV. Fascinated to see how it plays out. Puts to rest the idea that Iran is monolithically evil. We need to take a step back on sanctions and sabre rattling. We need to step back. (There's so much wrong with the Ben-Ami view on Iran -- and much else beside -- that it's beyond the scope of this report to address it.)

Grossman notes Iran is effectively a military dictatorship and we need both carrots and sticks.

Ken Levin notes that Ben-Ami is using a strawman -- the hawks understand that Iranians have a good population, but it doesn't matter because the Mullahs run the place. He takes on Ben-Ami for his past statements blaming the US and Israel for "pushing" Iran to pursue nukes.

As noted way up above, Ben-Ami declines a response. He never really responded to any of the few direct references to his own positions.

Question (we're in the Q&A portion now -- all questions were submitted on cards): Talk about Jerusalem.

Grossman accepts Bibi's statement about a united Jerusalem but there is discussion at the table that can yield compromise.

Ben-Ami notes his parents are buried on the Mount of Olives (apparently they weren't among those destroyed by the Jordanians when they controlled Jerusalem). Some parts will "return" to Arab control but agrees it's a beginning point.

Levin agrees with Grossman, but notes they must also consider the wishes of the Arab residents as to what country they want to reside in.

Question: If the cause of the violence is the refusal o accept a Jewish State, then how is the creation of a Palestinian State the solution?

Ben-Ami: (On demands that the PA accept Israel as a Jewish State) "I don't need anyone's approval to tell me what Israel is. This is a red herring to delay final settlement." (Ben-Ami, of course, misses the entire point. The question of the PA accepting a Jewish State is a test question -- are you going to accept a state, or is this just step one in a two-step process?) We must take a walk in the shoes of the other. When Jews get together, we talk and tend to blame everything on the Arabs, when the Arabs get together in their own venues, they tend to blame everything on the Jews...

Here came the only real disruption of the evening when one of Federman's lunatic friends stood up and started yelling at Ben-Ami (of all people) that that wasn't true, that Muslims aren't like that...(note she had no problem with the first part of the formulation)...Sarna very quickly and forcefully stepped in and threatened to have the woman thrown out. Ben-Ami tried to placate her and say he was only exaggerating to make a point...she was mostly quiet after that. [Edit: I'm told she was mostly quiet because she was, in fact, escorted out.]

Levin: It's very important that Arabs accept Israel as a Jewish State. Arafat said he wanted a state and then would go after Israel itself. He brings up J-Street's support for the showing of the play 7 Jewish Children (widely considered anti-Semitic) and notes he's against this sort of moral equivalency. Are there Jews who express the hateful things Jews say in that play? Yes, but every Jewish institution is against it, while every Arab institution promotes it.

Question: Imagine you get three wishes. What are they?

Ben-Ami: 1) A strong and principled US president to lead the peace process. 2) A visionary Israeli leader. 3) A visionary Palestinian leader. (Pure moral equivalency.)

Grossman: Talks about electric cars and some other safe political stuff...

Ken Levin: 1) Democratization throughout the Arab world (not just elections). 2) Wishes all minorities in the Arab world would have a right to independence. 3) Every Jewish child should be given a real Jewish education -- one that provides them with knowledge of their own cultural heritage.

And that was that. Ben-Ami was quiet, never combative (not the Ben-Ami of online political activism), just happy to be there. Grossman gave decent, safe, political answers. Ken Levin brought the most to the table, but it was unfortunate that his own mere presence gave credibility to Ben-Ami's.

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